Old Ski Fields

Discussion in 'Lake Mountain' started by rollyz, Jul 5, 2007.

  1. rollyz

    rollyz Dedicated Member

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2005
    Messages:
    1,438
    Likes Received:
    168
    Ok, here is a thread for a bit of fun. And a possible mission, for anyone who wishes to accept it....

    Where are all the old Ski fields in Aus? Got any old pics when they were active? Got any current pics? And, for a bit of fun, (and a possible lot of hiking), try and ski some of these old slopes. Post pics here if you achieve any.


    I might start with Kiandra. (Aus. 1st ski field)

    I know of a tow at Cabramurra. Think there was one around Kings Cross. Will have to try some old slopes up near Corin.
     
    cin, Vermillion and Highplainwarrior like this.
  2. Bogong

    Bogong Addicted Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2005
    Messages:
    10,926
    Likes Received:
    24
    Gosh Rolly asks a lot of difficult questions. But this time I've already done the research. [​IMG]

    Here is a list of every Australian lift ever built outside current ski resorts, many are still operating. http://wikiski.com/wiki/index.php/Non_resort_rope_tows

    Of course there were other popular ski areas that never had lifts such as

    - Mt Donna Buang, Vic. Four ski lodges and cleared runs before WWII.
    - Mt Bogong, Vic.
    - Mt Rufus, Tas.
     
    #2 Bogong, Jul 5, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 14, 2013
  3. rollyz

    rollyz Dedicated Member

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2005
    Messages:
    1,438
    Likes Received:
    168
    Thats awesome Bogong! Heaps of info [​IMG] Well that will put me in the right direction [​IMG]
     
    #3 rollyz, Jul 5, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 11, 2013
    BRYANHAIG likes this.
  4. Bogong

    Bogong Addicted Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2005
    Messages:
    10,926
    Likes Received:
    24
    Thanks Rolly. It took me six months to assemble all that! Thanks for the feedback. I may digest it all into a table format to make for easier browsing.

    I just remembered that Mt Wellington in Hobart was popular before the war too. After the war, skiers abandoned it for Mt Mawson (also known as Mt Field or National Park or Lake Dobson).

    I'm not as good at NSW ski history as I am on Vic and Tas, but in the 1940's people were running popular ski accommodation in the block of freehold land (or long term leasehold?) east of Jagungal. The name is on the tip of my tongue, but I'll leave it to someone else to look up.
     
  5. rollyz

    rollyz Dedicated Member

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2005
    Messages:
    1,438
    Likes Received:
    168
    I like the link about the portable ski lift (rope tow) [​IMG] Be great to have one of those and ski all day anywhere! I could set up a temporay ski run when it snows out here at Yetholme on a farm paddock. I could sell Hot Dogs for $8.50 ea to give that ski resort experience [​IMG]
     
    #5 rollyz, Jul 5, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 11, 2013
  6. Craig D.

    Craig D. Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2005
    Messages:
    765
    Likes Received:
    2
    Bogong, do you know anything about the ski tow at Round Mountain? It is shown on maps in the early editions of Snowy Mountain Walks by the Geehi Club (I have the 3rd and 6th editions here). No mention of it or the associated structures in the KHA huts list however. Next time I am in the area I will have a scratch around for any relics.

    The KHA huts list also mentions Montagues hut near the Tooma Reservior being used as a ski tow shelter by the SMA. Haven't checked out this site either, and information seems to be hard to come by (hut burnt down in 1986).

    In the past there were lodges located almost on the park boundary in the vicinity of Cesjacks Hut, but the land was resumed by NPWS. I spent some time looking for the remains of some of the lodges (Nordheim, Katingal & Bogong) two years ago and found very little. Another building called Jaanga was located further to the north; I haven't attempted to locate this yet, however a photo and some info on this building was published in the KHA newsletter a few years ago. A book was written about the whole land resumption ordeal called 'On the edge of the wilderness' by Brian Haig; I haven't tracked down a copy yet.

    There are still lodge(s) located in the Snowy Plains area east of Jagungal. Would love to find out more about them!
     
  7. Bogong

    Bogong Addicted Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2005
    Messages:
    10,926
    Likes Received:
    24
    Craig, I love your avatar, it's brilliant!

    Thanks for the info on the Tooma and Round Mountain tows. I assume this is the Round Mountain on the sealed Corryong - Kiandra road?

    Just when I get too confident that I've nabbed all the old rope tows, someone tells me about two more!

    You can get the basics on NSW ski history from Klaus Hueneke's books. (He sent me a complete set in return for me sending him 20 pages of suggestions and corrections for the manuscript for his Victorian huts book. [​IMG] )

    There are ads for the east of Jagungal ski lodge in late 1940's copies of the Australian Ski Yearbook. PM me if you really want details or photocopies.
     
    #7 Bogong, Jul 5, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2013
  8. Bogong

    Bogong Addicted Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2005
    Messages:
    10,926
    Likes Received:
    24
    Actually, if you want to do some amateur ski archeology, there is one remaining ski lodge at the bottom of the former main Donna Buang ski run. It's collapsed, but everything is still there. Before the war there were at least four ski lodges at Donna. One or two were toasted in the 1939 fires, one or two were shifted to Buller in the late 1940's, but this one appears to have been abandoned. At the moment, I have no idea who it belonged to. Does anyone know?

    These photos were taken on a phone, so they're a tad rough.
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    #8 Bogong, Jul 5, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 11, 2013
    ladycamper likes this.
  9. Craig D.

    Craig D. Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2005
    Messages:
    765
    Likes Received:
    2
    Thanks Bogong. I stole my avatar from another forum when I started uni a couple of years ago. Alas, my days of living on government handouts are numbered, as I finish my course at the end of this year!

    Yep, the Round Mountain in question is the one just to the south of the Khancoban - Cabramurra Road. Below is a scan of the map from the 6th edition of Snowy Mountain Walks (1983). I suspect the tow would have been removed by then, as it is not shown on the 3rd edition of the Kosciusko 1:100k map (1982).

    [​IMG]

    It would have been a great location for the tow, as Round Mountain is covered in stunted snowgums and a bit sparse on top (easy clearing). Will definately explore this location during the summer.

    Here is a scan of the 1:50k Khancoban map showing Montagues hut.

    [​IMG]

    It is at a lower elevation, and much clearing would have been required to carve a run out of the forest. However it would have been convenient for the residents of Theiss Village, which was located about 1km east of the Tooma dam wall. The hut itself would have been used for shelter, and I assume the tow would have ran up the side of the hill to the north. Finding any remains of a tow at this site would be difficult due to extensive regrowth following the 2003 fires, but I may give it a go if I have the time [​IMG]

    No doubt both tows were associated with the Snowy Mountains Scheme. I don't remember reading anything about the tows in any of Klaus Hueneke's books, but they may be mentioned in some of the books on the Snowy Scheme.

    I also have many photos of the remains of Kunama Hutte and the Northcote tow hut taken at Easter, as well as some of the Stilwell chairlift top station. Can post them if anyone is interested [​IMG]
     
    #9 Craig D., Jul 5, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 11, 2013
  10. Bogong

    Bogong Addicted Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2005
    Messages:
    10,926
    Likes Received:
    24
    I've already pulled out my books and maps. The earliest edition I have of the Geehi book is the 5th ed, 1978. I can't find anything relevant in my Snowy Mountains history books, yet to check Snowy Hydro books, but now I know it was there, I will eventually find something.

    But you have to be sceptical about the Tooma ski lift at 1,300 metres altitude so far north. In Victoria, it's possible at that altitude, in Tassie they are quite common, but at the northern end of the Snowy Mountains?

    In the meantime, I've added Round Mountain to the Wikiski non resort ski tows page as a definite and Montague's as a possible.
     
  11. Craig D.

    Craig D. Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2005
    Messages:
    765
    Likes Received:
    2
    I share some of your scepticism about the Tooma ski lift. I imagine would have only been in place whilst the dam was being built. However we must remember that throughout Hueneke's books there are references to people such as Ted Winter skiing regularly to Pretty Plain Hut, which is only at 1400m. As the likely slope faces south it would retain snow fairly well.

    Anyway, I will be interested to see if you can find any information on either location [​IMG]
     
    #11 Craig D., Jul 5, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 11, 2013
  12. snow_crazy

    snow_crazy Just Registered

    Joined:
    May 4, 2005
    Messages:
    647
    Likes Received:
    0
    Does anybody have any details on the mount donna buang ski run/ski hut setup? i live not far from there and i'd be interested in checking it out...
     
  13. climberman

    climberman CloudRide1000 Legend
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2000
    Messages:
    26,810
    Likes Received:
    7,967
    'Lodges' may be a bit of a stretch for a few of those CraigD.

    Katingal is on private property and is labelled on the Series II Dept Lands maps as 'Katingal'. Kore Grundsun (sp?) (XC legend, Snowy hydro migrant worker, stonemason, ex of Eucumbene Cove) is the previous owner, now owned by a group of folks. My folks have done some XC trips in the past with Kore there. Nice spot. Dunno how it did in the big fires.

    I have read Brian's (somewhat bitter) book as part of my honours thesis. Try UNSW library ?

    I don't know Nordheim or Bogong. Does Klaus Hueneke's book mention them?
     
    #13 climberman, Jul 7, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 17, 2013
  14. Craig D.

    Craig D. Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2005
    Messages:
    765
    Likes Received:
    2
    Thanks for that information climberman. I'm no expert on the Snowy Plains area, but have walked through there a few times. Beautiful place. Klaus Hueneke's books briefly mention Brian Haig and Bogong Lodge. Will try the UNSW library for his book.

    Here is what the KHA Huts List (1997) has on the buildings.

    Nordheim - Built 1976-7 by Kore Grunnsund, Brian Haig & others on land then outside the Park being brought by Haig. Accidently burnt 1979. GR 311983 on the Khancoban 1:50k map. Paddy Pallin briefly refers to this lodge in his book 'Never Truly Lost' on p217.

    Katingal - Built 1977 by Kore Grunnsund on land then outside the park being brought by Haig. Relocated outside Park in Gungarlin Valley 1979. 1 room, iron roof, stone & timber walls. Marked & named at GR 311984 on Khancoban map.

    Bogong Lodge - Built 1978-9 by Brian Haig, Renzo Dalmaso and others for sking on land then outside Park being bought by Haig. NPWS resumed land 1985, destroyed lodge 1987 amidst legal & financial wrangling. 5 rooms, iron walls & roof, wooden floor on concrete slab. GR 312984 on Khancoban map. Photo below is from KHA collection at the National Library; click for full size.

    [​IMG]

    The only remains I could find in the vicinity where these buildings were was a sheet of iron (looks the wall cladding in the above photo), a smaller piece of rusty corrugated iron and a couple of small lumps of concrete. Couldn't even say exactly where the buildings were! NPWS must have done a very thorough job of cleaning up the site.

    Jaanga - Built 1976 by members of Sydney Bushwalkers for skiing, on land then outside Park being bought by Brian Haif. NPWS resumed land 1985, removed roof 1989. GR 314996 on Khancoban map.

    Below are the other skiing-related buildings in the Snowy Plains area. I haven't been to any of them.

    Kore Grunnsund's - I assume this is Katingal? Not sure of its location.

    Kore Grunnsund's New - Looks rather fancy. Unsure of its location.

    Bulls Peaks Lodge - This is marked & named at GR 313966 on the Jagungal 1:25k map. Clearly visible from the old vehicle track that heads from Cesjacks along the crest of the Great Dividing Range towards the Bulls Peaks.

    Snowy Vale - Not marked on any maps, and I'm not sure of its exact location.. Built prior to 1991 - could this have been a replacement for the buildings lost when the land was resumed by NPWS? Photo below courtesy Gary Duncan; click for full size.

    [​IMG]

    Snowy Vale Upper - As above. Apparently burnt in the 2003 fires?

    [​IMG]
     
    #14 Craig D., Jul 7, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 14, 2013
  15. climberman

    climberman CloudRide1000 Legend
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2000
    Messages:
    26,810
    Likes Received:
    7,967
    I think Haig took a bit of a punt. Happened at a very peculiar time in NPWS internal politics - very much the start of the big shift to closing access, reducing human visibility, testing legislation. Thankfully in NSW that has been largely reversed and quite a different policy set exists for the most part in the NPS of DECC.
     
    ladycamper likes this.
  16. Bogong

    Bogong Addicted Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2005
    Messages:
    10,926
    Likes Received:
    24
    Snow crazy, briefly:
    Skiing took off hugely in the early 1920's in Vic. No ski clubs in 1923, nine by 1929, 30 odd in the 1930's

    In the times when few people had cars, Donna was the closest reliable snow to Melb. (Not reliable any more [​IMG] ). In the late 1920's people took the train to Warburton and hired a "charabanc" (looks a bit like a strech convertable car with 4 rows of seats) to take them up the mountain. Clubs that built lodges in the early 1930's included University Ski Club, Ski Club of Vic, and a couple of others that I can look up if anyone really wants me to.

    Big working bees were organised to clear runs including the main run east from summit, which still exists downhill from the dunny block. The ruined lodge (see photos above) is at the base of this run. They also built a proper wooden ski jump, but I'm almost certain there was never a ski tow.

    Victoria's worst ever fires in 1939 toasted some lodges, but others survived, so this MAY indicate that they weren't all together. By the late 1940's there was a good gravel road to Buller and post-war, most people had cars. After the war, some people including Uni S.C. moved their pre-fabricated lodges to Buller where the snow was better. So Donna with it's increasingly dodgy snow was abandoned by skiers in the late 1940's. The Uni S.C. lodge from Donna survived at Buller until the 1970's as an overflow annex. It's original chimney is still hidden in the bush at Donna, but I'm not sure quite where. (I would really like to know.)

    Other Donna stuctures. There have been three towers on the summit. The first was four tall tree trunks with a platform nailed between them high up. The second was an old mining "poppet head", the third is the current tower with the strange double helix staircase.

    One day I will get off my bum and write this down in a proper history that I'll post in wikiski with details, photos etc. If a few people ask, I'll try to do it in the next few weeks, otherwise I may take years...
     
    #16 Bogong, Jul 8, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2013
  17. BRYANHAIG

    BRYANHAIG Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2011
    Messages:
    2
    Likes Received:
    0
     
  18. benchives

    benchives Part of the Furniture
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2006
    Messages:
    15,308
    Likes Received:
    4,415
    You win thread mining championship, nearly eight years old!
     
    ladycamper likes this.
  19. Highplainwarrior

    Highplainwarrior Just Registered

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2015
    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    0
    Thanks rollyz, great topic.
    Lake Mountain have a couple of old ski runs listed on the old broadbents maps of Marysville in Victoria.
    I believe Ski run 11 used to exist in the snowy paddock area, and Ski run 21 was located 200 mtrs SSW of Gerraties car park. I remember visiting both in the early 80s. not sure about before then, but I don't think there were any ski tows. Both areas were closed mid to late 80s probably because they were to steep? About the same time they banned the use of thin plastic sheeting.
    Hopefully someone can give us some earlier history on the area?
     
  20. Highplainwarrior

    Highplainwarrior Just Registered

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2015
    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    0
    I have seen these remains too, and wondered about the history behind them.
    Great thanks for the information Bogong.
     
  21. Highplainwarrior

    Highplainwarrior Just Registered

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2015
    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    0
    I have done some further digging on the two old ski runs at Lake Mountain, and discovered there was 3 huts at the bottom of the hill on the banks of the taggerty river. There is a 1.5 to 2 km walking track leading strait up the side of the mountain from the huts to Ski run 21. I have been to the area of the huts, but have not seen. Maybe someone will know?
    Further research on ski run 11 reveals a single hut close to the summit of snowy hill, which would put it above the old ski run 11? Hopefully someone can contribute some more information to the areas history
    Correction to my first comment ; The old map with ski run information is a 'Gregory's' Marysville, and not a Broadbent.
     
  22. Budgiesmuggler

    Budgiesmuggler Addicted Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    May 7, 2010
    Messages:
    5,340
    Likes Received:
    2,317
    Just checked your wiki... My father is involved with Mt Wills and is a former president of the ski club.

    The rope tow is still operational and gets used but only by members and very occasionally.

    I've not been there in a long time but I remember it being used in the mid 90s.
     
    Highplainwarrior likes this.
  23. Highplainwarrior

    Highplainwarrior Just Registered

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2015
    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    0
  24. Apresski

    Apresski Pool Room
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2007
    Messages:
    42,810
    Likes Received:
    6,033

    Not sure whether this is the hut you are referring to...

    The Marysville division of the SCV held its inaugural meeting on May 28, 1939, with 20 people signing up and Berry Higgs elected as president. In 1940, a basic hut was built at the foot of the Snowy Hill run, accommodating eight people. It had an earth floor which was often soggy and wet and no bunks. In the same year, Marysville SCV members and the Rover scouts joined forces to cut a trail over the top of Snowy Hill.
    http://lakemountainresort.com.au/visitor-info/lake-mountain-resort-history
     
    cin and Highplainwarrior like this.
  25. Highplainwarrior

    Highplainwarrior Just Registered

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2015
    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    0
    Thanks Apresski,
    I am now inspired to do some more exploring and fosiking in the area after reading link.
    'With the onset of war in 1943, enthusiasm waned and it was not until 1947 that interest was re-kindled and large areas were cleared for skiing at Snowy Hill. By 1955, a four hectare gentle slope had been cleared with ski runs and playgrounds constructed around the area today known as the Berry Higgs Playground. Meanwhile, the original cross country ski trails at Lake Mountain were ex-logging roads that had been used post-war as access roads to the Federation and Sandstone ranges.
     
  26. Apresski

    Apresski Pool Room
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2007
    Messages:
    42,810
    Likes Received:
    6,033
    @teckel may be able to put you in touch with Bogong, who no longer seems to be a member on here. He is extremely knowledgeable about this sort of stuff
     
  27. Kletterer

    Kletterer Addicted Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2014
    Messages:
    8,015
    Likes Received:
    5,764
    There was a ski slope on Mt Carey Barrington Tops.
     
  28. BRYANHAIG

    BRYANHAIG Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2011
    Messages:
    2
    Likes Received:
    0
     
  29. weerab

    weerab Dedicated Member
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2009
    Messages:
    3,028
    Likes Received:
    456
    Is it possible that highplainwarrior is in fact Bogong reincarnated? just a thought!
     
  30. teckel

    teckel Old And Crusty
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2004
    Messages:
    35,257
    Likes Received:
    2,674
    No. Bogong would not have misspelled "fossicking".
     
    climberman, Rimey, cin and 2 others like this.
  31. Ziggy

    Ziggy Addicted Member
    30 Day Pass

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2003
    Messages:
    7,214
    Likes Received:
    1,279
    Bogong's book is out, I read somewhere.
     
  32. Apresski

    Apresski Pool Room
    Season Pass Gold

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2007
    Messages:
    42,810
    Likes Received:
    6,033
    So did I on FB.
     
  33. system32

    system32 Just Registered

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2016
    Messages:
    18
    Likes Received:
    0
    read similar things
     
  34. system32

    system32 Just Registered

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2016
    Messages:
    18
    Likes Received:
    0
    Although each to their own
     
  35. Mister Tee on snow shoes

    Mister Tee on snow shoes Dedicated Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2015
    Messages:
    825
    Likes Received:
    543
    Mt. Wills here in Vic. has an old ski rope tow and a once cleared but now overgrown downhill slope that was functioning back in the day .There is the Tallangatta ski club lodge there but the summit area gets more snow these days and the Mt. Wills summit hut is superb and free.